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Surface Level

Surface Level

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A weekly show hosted by longtime friends Jordan, Damon, and Tony, explores the complexities of the Black and Queer experience. Through personal stories, dynamic guests, and curious conversations, this series offers a nuanced understanding of identity, race, and sexuality that goes beyond the surface level, with a touch of humor and a fearless willingness to challenge the norm.
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Jordan, Damon, & Tony are curious – when will folx learn to trust Black women? This week, we're thrilled to welcome director, producer, and screenwriter Lee Daniels to our Surface Level family. We’ll dissect the theme of trusting Black women in his new film, The Deliverance. We’ll also highlight some of the Black women who have helped shape our per…
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Jordan, Damon, & Tony are curious – are you ready to go beyond the surface level with us? With this episode, we close another chapter in the journey of Surface Level. For the ninth time, we open the floor to questions from you, our Surface Level Insiders. We explore a range of topics, including dating, sex, work life, parenthood, and more. It’s a f…
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Jordan, Damon, & Tony are curious – what role does porn play in our understanding of sex? We round out Throb, our season on sex, with an exploration of our past and present relationship with pornography. We discuss our initial introduction to porn and the positive and negative impacts it had on us as young adults. We then explore its role today, bo…
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Jordan, Damon, & Tony are curious – how important is sexual compatibility? This week, we explore the value placed on sexual compatibility when considering romantic partners. We discuss our role in fulfilling our partners' various desires, how honest we have been about our own desires in new relationships, and methods of fulfillment that do not rely…
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Jordan, Damon, & Tony are curious – are we ready for Queer men to sing about sex? This week, we're thrilled to welcome music artist serpentwithfeet to our Surface Level Family. We'll dive into the overtly sexual themes of his latest album, Grip, and examine how these themes have been received by the community at large. Are there differences in how …
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Jordan, Damon, & Tony are curious – do HIV criminalization laws increase stigma? This week, we are excited to welcome Robert Suttle, a social justice advocate, to our Surface Level Family. We'll be discussing his personal experiences and advocacy work concerning the impact of HIV criminalization laws on Queer communities. Many of these laws, enacte…
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Jordan, Damon, & Tony are curious – are you sexual on social media? We're thrilled to announce a two-part crossover episode with special guests, Busy Boys Uncensored. In part two, we welcome Jah and Sekani into our Surface Level family. Together, we delve into how sex and dating have permeated everyday social media apps. Is there shame associated w…
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Jordan, Damon, & Tony are curious – are hookup apps in their flop era? We're excited to announce a two-part crossover episode featuring special guests, Busy Boys Uncensored. In part one, we welcome Mayce and Damontae into our Surface Level family. Together, we delve into the culture of "the apps" and their profound impact on our sexual interactions…
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Jordan, Damon, & Tony are curious – what language should we use to discuss STIs? Part of maintaining a healthy sex life involves regular screenings for STIs. Over time, the way we discuss this topic has taken a negative turn. The question "are you clean?" has become synonymous with STI disclosure, adding public shame to the personal stigma people f…
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Jordan, Damon, & Tony are curious – how do we reduce harm when drug use and Queer sex intersect? This week, as we delve into a sensitive topic, we welcome Andrea Rodriguez, Community Cultivation Coordinator for Dance Safe, to our Surface Level Family. This episode explores the realities of drug use among Queer folx and how to provide comprehensive …
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Jordan, Damon, & Tony are curious – what is medical fact vs fiction when it comes to Queer male sex? This week, class is in session, and we are thrilled to welcome Dr. Leo Moorei, the Medical Director for Clinic Services at the Los Angeles County Department of Public Health, to our Surface Level Family. We're diving deep into aspects of sexual hygi…
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Jordan, Damon, & Tony are curious – how can casual sex be used as a tool for exploration and empowerment? During this dynamic episode, we welcome storyteller and activist Tarek Ali to our Surface Level Family. Tarek contributes to a conversation centered on the complex relationship that queer men have with casual sex. Casual sex is often viewed sim…
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Jordan, Damon, & Tony are curious – what impact does hookup culture have on Queer male intimacy? For our ninth season titled “Throb,” we are embarking on a journey to explore all aspects of sex and sexuality. We kick off this journey with a topic familiar to queer men: hookup culture. Where have we found the most joy in hooking up, and what memorie…
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Jordan, Damon, & Tony are curious – are you ready to go beyond the surface level with us? We made it through another cycle of the Surface Level journey. Through this season of reflection, we hope that we were able to introduce you some new figures or expand your knowledge of familiar faces. We believe truly that there is much to learn from our Quee…
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Jordan, Damon, & Tony are curious – with time can Queer love exist without shame? In this episode, we are excited to welcome actor Noah J. Ricketts to our Surface Level family. Exploring the themes of his incredible character Frankie from the miniseries Fellow Travelers we delve into the expanse of how Queer people express love. We close our season…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – does cash rule everything around you? This week we talk about the ever-looming presence of capitalism. What experiences have shaped our relationship with money, have we ever felt looked down upon because of material things we lacked, how have we navigated mainly White professional spaces as Black Queer professiona…
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Jordan, Damon, & Tony are curious – where is the line between funny and offensive? In this episode, we are joined by comedian, actor * writer Jay Jurdan. The artform of comedy has been in the spotlight in recent years as we all try and define the line between jokes and insensitivity. We explore the artform and the need for specificity in discussing…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – is fear of femininity the thief of joy? This week we revisit our relationship with the expression of femininity in what we wear. Are we uncomfortable with expressing ourselves outside of the confines of the gender binary? Is that fear greater for men within our community than for women? We challenge what we’ve bee…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – what place does AI have in the creation of art? This week we bring a fresh topic to our listeners debating the benefits and concerns around artificial intelligence. We focus in on generative AI and its effect on the world of art. Should we look for ways to make the creation of art more efficient and democratize it…
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Jordan, Damon, & Tony are curious – why are conservatives so scared of drag queens? In this episode, we are joined by drag phenom Olivia Lux. With her first-hand account from her time on Drag Race, we use the life and lessons of RuPaul in this week’s reflection. We explore our first impressions of the art form filled with surprise and delight. Oliv…
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Jordan, Damon, & Tony are curious – if your humanity is conditional is it humanity at all? Surface Level began as a show reflecting the lives, experiences, and conversation of its three host. To have a season live during the ongoing Middle Eastern conflict and not share our experience processing, learning, and developing our views towards the situa…
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Jordan, Damon, & Tony are curious – what are the risks it takes to bloom into who we really are? In this episode, we're honored to be joined by trans activist and the author of "The Risk It Takes To Bloom: On Life and Liberation," Raquel Willis. To kick things off, we engage in an icebreaker game that pays homage to Sylvia Rivera, a trailblazing tr…
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00:00-Introduction 00:54-Recap since season 7 10:00-Unveiling the season 8 theme: "A Reflection" 10:46-Engaging in a game inspired by Little Richard 18:04-Exploring the toughest aspects of our journey to self-acceptance 29:37-Thoughts on creators who reject or conceal their queerness 35:51-Delving into what aspects of our lives we choose to keep pr…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – how have our views around relationships become more fluid?This week we offer a second look at fluidity; this time through the lens of relationship types. We welcome Jahad J.C. Carter, host of the Hopeless Romantic Society, back to the Surface Level table. A topic that is enriched through the technicolor lens of Qu…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – how have our views around our sex lives become more fluid?Surprise we’re back for a special two-part bonus series! We’re adding the fluidity of water to our season, first tackling the topic of sexuality. We welcome Jahad J.C. Carter to our Surface Level Family. Host of the viral digital series, Hopeless Romantic S…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – are you ready to go beyond the surface level with us?Once again we sign off after this very special season grounded in earth, freed through wind, and emboldened by fire. We hope we’ve succeeded in our mission to make you more curious about topics that are not typically broached. Special thanks to all of our amazin…
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Damon, Jordan & Tony are curious – how can healthy disagreement lead to personal growth?Closing the fire series, our penultimate episode for season seven explores what happens when tempers boil over. We recognize that even in our closest relationships there is bound to be conflict, but how we approach these situations make the difference in our liv…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – how does aligning with traditional beauty standards benefit and harm our community?Pretty privilege, the hot-button topic that has been at the forefront of many kitchen tables has made its way to Surface Level. This week we welcome Obio Jones, Digital Creator and LGBTQIA+ Advocate to our Surface Level family. We a…
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Jordan & Tony are curious – how can we broaden what it means to be Black and excellent?In this unprecedented bonus episode, we revisit our season opener, 'Black Excellence Is A Scam,' from a fresh perspective. While Damon is absent this week (rest assured, he'll be back in full effect next week!), we are excited to welcome Eboni K. Williams, an Aut…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – how does the work of Queer nightlife curators impact our ability to find community?In closing out Wind series, we are excited to pay tribute to a space that has long represented freedom for Queer individuals: nightlife. This supersized episode of Surface Level is dedicated to the legacy of Black Queer nightlife gi…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – how is the quest to not just survive but thrive unique within Black Trans experience ?In an effort to continue to introduce you to amazing members of our community this week we welcome Tabytha Gonzalez to our Surface Level Family. A human rights professional and a woman with a story that deserves to be told we spe…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – how do we protect our joy when pride is under attack?We bring you something special edition of Surface Level for Pride 2023! We are happy to share our favorite pride memories, delve into a conversation around the attack on Queer representation from conservatives, and offer a little bit of Surface Level drag story …
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – What was our parent’s journey in accepting our Queer identity?This episode will likely take the crown as our most personal level ever. This week we welcome Annette Epps, Teresa Randall, and Tony Jermin Sr, better known as our parents, to our Surface Level family. We explore the joy, surprise, pain, and confusion t…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious - How can we dismantle mental health stigmas and foster understanding?In this episode as we navigate the complex terrain of mental health. We welcome Jarred Denzel Keller to our Surface Level Family. Jarred, a Mental Health Advocate and Senior Press Secretary for the Human Rights Campaign, bears his truth for all to…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – is Black Excellence doing more harm than help?In this thought-provoking episode, we challenge the notion of "Black Excellence" and explore the unrealistic pressures that surround it. This special episode was recorded in front of a live audience, marking an exciting milestone for our podcast. Together, we seek to r…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – are you ready to go beyond the surface level with us?Another season in the books for this journey that we call Surface Level. We have a blast connecting with our listeners through a series of audience submitted questions. We’re a bit off the cuff an we’re sure you’ll enjoy it. This season we’ve worked to create vi…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – who are we…really?This season’s penultimate episode forces us to look within in a very meaningful way. First we give language to the guiding principles that define us at our core, then we assess our intersectional experience as Black Queer people regarding what parts of our identity we are most comfortable with or…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – why are men afraid to embrace beauty?If you walk away with one thing from this episode, know that if beating that face makes you happy, do it! We welcome Sir John to our Surface Level Family. Sir John, Creative Director and global make-up artist, brings a fun and insightful perspective to this conversation. As men…
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ordan, Damon & Tony are curious – is categorizing certain stories as trauma porn fair?This week is centered around the hot topic of “trauma porn”. We have seen various stories that highlight the painful history of Black Americans. Sometimes it feels that these are the only stories Hollywood wants to share about us. We interrogate the line between a…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – how does the approval of others lead us to hide parts ourselves?Today’s episode explores the idea of hiding parts of who we are to gain acceptance in various spaces. We welcome Elegance Bratton to our Surface Level Family. Elegance, the director of the critically acclaimed film The Inspection, speaks on his journe…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – how can establishing healthier relationships with alcohol?We are all guilty of the proclamation “I’m never drinking again” after a rough night on the bottle. Maybe that was driven by a desire for a good time or from a need to escape darker emotions. We explore those dueling motives in this episode. From CDC guidel…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – how does self-hate create toxicity among Black, Queer men?Our show often highlights external factors that stifle our community, but this week is focused on self-reflection. Growing up as Black, Queer men we develop many defense mechanisms that manifest as self-hate. This hate is often reflected in the othering of …
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – are the benefits of abiding by respectability politics worth the cultural sacrifice?Today’s episode gets into heated territory at times as we debate the benefits, or lack thereof, for following the rules of respectability politics. We welcome Kalen Allen to our Surface Level Family. Kalen, actor and media personal…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – has our fear of judgment stifled our sexual liberation?Safe spaces are important for Black Queer people and that idea extending to sexual environments is no different. We have some fun exploring our personal do’s and don’t in these situations and highlight how we as a community contribute to each other’s liberatio…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – what can we do to make Black Queer stories more visible?In this season opener, we highlight the cultural moments that have made us feel most seen, we interrogate the internal and external factors limiting further visibility for our community, and we discuss our hopes for further advancement of the Black Gay agenda…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – are you ready to go beyond the surface level with us?The finale to our fifth season further highlights our expanded commitment to community. We kick off by welcoming Steve Cruz, Strategic Giving Manager for the Ali Forney Center and Maddox Guerilla, an Ali Forney Center alum, to our Surface Level family. We were p…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – what did we learn when traversing the toughest moments in our friendship?This week’s episode is quite introspective and discusses the evolution of our views on friendship in recent years. We play a game that gives our response to messy friendship scenarios, then discuss the experience of growing apart from friends…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – how can healthcare information best be communicated to Black Queer folx?This week’s episode takes a relevant look at healthcare discussions that started during COVID are now being renewed with onset of Monkeypox. We start as always with a bit of silliness in an animal themed game of ridiculous choices, then dissec…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – how is the Black German experience different from that of Black Americans?This week’s episode is a special glimpse into our lives as friends sharing highlights from our experience at Berlin Pride. During the episode we play a game of Bop or Flop with various experiences we had on the trip, dissect the key differen…
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Jordan, Damon & Tony are curious – how can we foster non-sexual male intimacy?This week, we explore the idea of intimacy between men both Straight and Queer. We play a game rating potential partners based on fun dating scenarios, then discuss how the stigma around sexuality has impacted our relationships with Straight men, if sex and intimacy can h…
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