Podcasts By Dr. Kirk Adams: January 6, 2025: Interview with Advocate, Author and Sight Loss Coach Donna J. Jodhan

Podcasts By Dr. Kirk Adams

TRANSCRIPT

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Music.

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Welcome to podcasts by Dr Kirk Adams, where we bring you powerful conversations with leading voices in disability rights, employment and inclusion. Our guests share their expertise, experiences and strategies to inspire action and create a more inclusive world. If you're passionate about social justice or want to make a difference, you're in the right place. Let's dive in with your host, Dr Kirk Adams,

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hello, everybody. This is Dr Kirk Adams from innovative impact consulting and welcome to my podcast. And I have I'm returning a favor to Donna jodhan, who graciously interviewed me for her podcast. Welcome Donna. Thank you very much. I'm glad to be here, and it is a New Year. Happy New Year to you, to you too. And I'd like to take this one step at a time. What I'm thinking is to ask you to tell us about your journey which has brought you, has brought you to the point in time we're at now, what you're involved in currently, and then where, where you would like to see, where we you would like to take things, and when we, when we talk about where you would like to take things, I'd love to hear about what's working well for you, where, where you're finding successes and any challenges you might be having. So if, if we could just take it away, I'll hand you the talking stick and ask you to talk about your journey from from birth to present. Oh dear. Thank you very much. I'll do the best I can. So I was born eight hours after my twin brother Jeffrey,

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Mom and Dad did not know that I was expected, only after he was born that the midwife told mom and dad, hey, another one is on its way, and mom had to wait eight hours for me to arrive.

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The mom and dad asked the midwife to call a doctor, and she refused. So mom suffered for eight hours, and when I was born, mom realized right away that something was wrong with my eyes, and she said to the midwife, this child has eye problems. And the midwife refused to, you know, listen to mom, but Mom was correct. So I guess this is probably the foundation for how I was brought up and what I felt that I needed to do in order to fulfill my own life and to help others. I felt strongly that I was given an opportunity to do something after being born under these circumstances, and I think from an early age, my desire was to help others,

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you know, to help make a better future for the kids, because I was given the opportunity to have a future. I was very privileged to have parents and a grandmother and two brothers and five dogs all helped me out. So I decided that this is what I wanted to do. I left home at a very early age, I grew up in Montreal, Canada, and

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I don't think I can ever put a date on when I really started to get involved in advocacy,

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but I think you know, throughout my high school and university years, I always did the best I could to help others and help the kids, but I think my whole world changed because let's just go back a little bit. I was born with bit of vision. Got a whole whack of it when I was in my teens due to a cornea transplant. It changed my entire world, and I learned so much, did so much experience, so much. Then I lost it all in year 2004

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due to a terrific retina detachment, detached in three places, and doctors could not save my vision. So it was at that time that I decided that I wanted to apply to the Canadian government for a job, and in doing so, I quickly realized that the websites were not accessible, the attitudes were not very good, because certain.

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Departments did not really want to take the time to ensure that me as a vision impaired person, a highly qualified one with an MBA from McGill University. They did not want to, you know, help me take the exams in order to gain a Public Service Commission job with the Canadian governments. And I think it was at that time that I consciously decided that something needed to be done. So in year 2006

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I consulted a human rights lawyer, and after discussing, you know, matters within she advised me that I had the perfect case for a charter challenge against the Canadian government to challenge them on their inaccessible and unusable websites. And there began my journey, I would say, in a really meaningful manner. And I say meaningful because it was a way for me to not just express myself, but to show others that something should be done and must be done if we as a community, as Canadians with disabilities, wanted to find different career paths, so I assembled a small team

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of advocates and friends, and I think they're about, oh my gosh, at least four of us to start with The lawyer. We filed our papers, and of course, they try to stay our kids, but fail. And so between 2007

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and 2009

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it was a back and forth battle between me and the government and my lawyer

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and the Canadian government hired an expert from the United States who was a lawyer, but not an accessibility expert, to challenge us, and I had one of the best accessibility experts of the day. Her name was Judah Trevor Rey. She's from Canada,

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and so the government I know her. Oh, great, yes, wonderful, yeah, you couldn't have picked a better person. Oh, she was wonderful and very calm, very kind, very understanding. And between 2007 and 2009 we engaged in this back and forth battle. And many times this government, Canadian government, did their best to discredit me, both personally and professionally, and they challenged Utah quite a bit. But Bucha and I, we were able to withstand all the that they threw at us. We went to court, the lower Canadian court in 2010

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we won the first round. The judge ordered the Canadian government to make all of their websites accessible,

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despite the government trying to, you know, use their expert, the late Cynthia Waddell. I don't know if you know her, or knew her

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to you know, thwart our efforts so we were successful. The judge ordered the government to make the websites accessible, but the government decided to take us to the Canadian Court of Appeal, and this case was heard in 2012

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and we were again successful. So thereafter, the government realized that we were serious about, you know, wanting to bring about change. This case was observed worldwide, across North America, Britain, Europe, India, and for me personally, it was quite an experience, because I don't think I really understood the meaning of going to court. I so that was a five year process of doing my math. Yeah, I

09:20

I don't think I understood what I was getting into, and even when the government attacked me personally and professionally, I still didn't understand.

09:31

But I spent several nights really examining my conscience. Why was I doing this? For whom? For what? It was never for me. It was for the kids or the future.

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And people may say, oh, yeah, right. Wasn't it for you? No, not necessarily. Because I wanted a better future for them. I wanted to help my community. So after that, in 2012

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we.

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Decided to soldier on, and you just and I went our separate ways, like Peter got busy with her own stuff, I got busy with mine. But then in 2015

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I realized that something else needed to be done, because Canada did not have any sort of legislation like the US, like the UK, like Europe, they were one of the few developed countries that did not have any sort of legislation, disability rights legislation, or anything like that. So I decided again to form a team, and we went coast to coast, we elicited the assistance of several organizations, national organizations, business cnid, the

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CCD, like Canadian Council of persons with disabilities and many others cross disabilities organizations. We lobbied hard, and I was very fortunate again to have you to part of the way,

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because she was very, very busy with her own stuff. And I had David Lepofsky, an amazing lawyer who really worked so hard with me, and in 2019

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legislation titled The accessible Canada Act was passed on July 19, 2019,

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and congratulations. Thank you very much. So this is what has laid the foundation for me. Has not been easy, because

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advocacy is not for the fate of heart, and it started to wear on me.

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During this period, I also fought successful cases against the Greater Toronto Airport Authority over their inaccessible and unusable websites and services and other organizations I interacted with,

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but I decided shortly after that victory, that I wanted to pull or push my own efforts, my own advocacy, in another direction, because it was getting too hard and it was wearing on me. It was being very, very stressful on me. So I made the conscious effort that I wanted to return to what I call my roots. This being that I wanted to work more closely with the kids. It took a few years to really, you know, hone my my commitment, to decide what I really wanted to do.

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I relinquished the presidency of barrier free Canada, because I was the founder of barrier free Canada. This is the organization that started the campaign for an accessible Canada Act. So let's fast forward to today. Yeah, but along the way, I met Aaron Di Blasi, and Aaron is never tired of pushing me and advising me and showing me ways to achieve what I really want to achieve, and I do. Thank Aaron for this very, very much indeed. So I'd like to pause for just a moment let people know who Aaron is. Aaron De Blasi is

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a publisher of several accessibility and assistive technology related publications. His company is called Mind vault solutions, so you can search for top tech tidbits, access information, news and I have recently been engaged with Aaron. He's helping me get organized and more impactful and effective. And I think you've worked with him a lot longer than I but I'm finding that he helps accelerate things and help helps me move forward more briskly

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with what I'm trying to accomplish. And I think this is a great way to say it like he helps me move forward more brisi, and especially when I see the first words of any email he sends, it's Miss Donna, and I know he has something to tell me, right? So the two initiatives that we are engaged in together are the access Park store, where we have brought vendors and other sellers together to sell their stuff, whether it's technology or anything that.

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They want to sell, and it's being advertised through the accessibility information, news and the top tech tidbits. But most recently, we decided to get together on another project, and it's called the vision Tech Academy.

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And this all came about because of a promise I made to the late John Connor Lee's. John was very, very involved with Apple. He was a beta tester. He was a teacher, tutor, a trainer. He had a website called Matt for the blind, and we have started to get involved in developing the vision Tech Academy, where we would bring users, not certainly, sorry, not users educators, together with students. But a month before, or shortly after we started, he wrote to me, saying that we had to withdraw from the project, because he was diagnosed with cancer, and he was at stage four, so I made him a promise that I could do whatever I think, because John was my mentor, my teacher, my friend, my advisor. Didn't matter if we disagreed on which coffee team we supported. John loved the islanders. I love the Montreal Canadiens, but John took the time to listen and to guide and he was never afraid or never shy to share his political views with me as well. So I lost someone really important in my life, and I thought I would I made him this promise, and here we are today. And Aaron and another friend of mine, Leo Bissonnette, he lives in Montreal, we are partnering together, partnering together, to ensure that John's legacy lives on. And this is where I'm at today. I'm also involved in something called transitioning to a new world, where I am teaching kids who are prepared preparing to leave high school, and the young adults teaching them how to make themselves indispensable assets to those companies who need to attract the attention of seniors and persons with disabilities, because these are their bread and butter customers. And I am helping.

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There are two courses that I'm giving

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are promoting and teaching. One is called advocacy, 101 and the other one is called entrepreneurship, 101

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and these two courses will help participants to become more confident and independent and show them ways to advocate for themselves and for others, more powerful and more effectively. So these are the two projects that I'm presently engaged in, the transitioning to a new world. Is that something you're doing with young people in person? Is it virtual? Is

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recorded. They watch what form does that take, virtually right now. And hopefully, if I can obtain, or

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if I can get funding to help me out, I would like to put these courses online, and I would like to do the face to face route as well. I have already had experience with Doctor Alan chase of the I retreat organization. I participated in his camp last year, and he has invited me back

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to do the same this year. So and I've had several interviews with people across Canada and the United States. So I'm really, really hoping that this will take off. And finally, in addition, in order to sort of support my funding, I am selling my pottery creations on the access Park store and my associates and I are also planning events to raise funds in support of the transitioning to a new world initiative. So that's where I'm at today. Okay, and access Park, let's talk about it sounds like it's a marketplace. Is it specifically for disability owned businesses or products and services that are helpful for inclusion of people with disabilities or combination? Tell, tell. Tell us more about access Park.

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I am hoping.

25:00

If educators take advantage of this, they sign up. They, you know, we have a directory of where people can come to find different types of educators. Educators can either, you know, just sign up by having the first name, last name, email address and a URL, or they could go into more detail through their premium profile, where they give a biography of themselves and the courses that they offer. And I'm really and again, these educators are focused on what

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I think they're focused on, courses, technology, courses that they can give to bridge the gap between, you know, persons with disabilities needing to learn more and being able to be more independent. That's what we're hoping for.

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So it could be anything that the technology wise, that they would be able to teach and train and tutor. Okay,

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so turning to challenges, you've mentioned funding and fundraising and resources a couple of times, yeah, so I'd appreciate you talking a little bit more about your thinking of how

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that's going, and then any, any other you mentioned, marketing, yes. So you're, you're running three startups here simultaneously, which

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is a lot, a lot on one person's plate. But as you plan success for each of the three, what, what do you see as the challenges that you're going to need to tackle?

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I think a lot of it would be like marketing, letting people know that these three initiatives are out there. A lot of it has to do, you know, like works with by word of mouth, but with whom you know and you know, like working to convince them that, hey, these are worthwhile initiatives. These are going to benefit persons with disabilities. The persons with disabilities are your bread and butter, customers of today and the future. The kids are important. We need to make it better than possible for our kids in the future. So we need to find, or I need to find funding to continue my efforts.

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And that is the challenge. And I know Aaron is really, you know, given me a lot of great ideas for the vision Tech Academy. I'm just hoping that this takes off, and I'm I'm very confident that it will take off.

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Far as funding goes. I'm not familiar with Canada, of course, in the United States, the 501 c3 nonprofit where people can make a donation and

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put a tax deduction on on their tax return. And then, of course, the for profit side, there's investors, and there's small business grants and things like that. So what? What type of and then there's crowdfunding, like Kickstarter for creative endeavors and GoFundMe and what, what are your

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structures, as far as the type of funding you're seeking,

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the nature, like

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in Canada, it is awfully, awfully, awfully difficult to find funding. In the US, it seems to be a lot easier, so I'm putting most of my eggs in the US basket. Okay,

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we've not talked about GoFundMe or crowdfunding. I mean, Aaron and I are hoping to use other methods to start with, but we're quite open to any suggestions. I'm not a marketing person. Aaron, is more of it than I am, right? So we're hoping, I'm praying, that we can attract some good influence from people who are willing to help, you know, fund this or market this in any way that they can.

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Um, so this is the part of the podcast where we're going to ask for help.

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What

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people listening if they want to help move things forward? Access Park. I assume you're looking for businesses who want to offer their products and services. You're looking for customers. So Tell, tell us

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to those listening to this recording,

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if they're interested in getting engaged in access Park, what, what? What type of participation are you looking for? And how do people get and go get in touch with you. So we're looking to.

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Vendors to sell their products on ancestr, and we have a ready made audience of over at least 30,000

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people who read the aim news every week and top tech tidbits.

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We do a lot of media releases as well. So we're hoping that vendors would see an advantage to being part of the access Park marketplace. We're hoping that customers would be able to say, Hey, this is a more accessible and usable website. I'm going to come here to buy my stuff. So it's a two pronged effort, both customers and vendors. And we've got to advertise more, because you just can't sit there and say, you know, people will read the ads every week. It's much more than that. So that's what the access Park thing is all about. Okay, and then transitioning into a new world. Are you primarily looking for? You mentioned camps, you mentioned schools? Are you primarily looking for organizations? Yes, who work with with blind youth, yes, primarily those. I have a meeting tomorrow with the American Printing House with the blind, and I'm really hoping that we would team up so that I can offer my courses. I'm hoping that the I retreat organization can help me to propel my efforts to other organizations and agencies. But the difficulty here is that a lot of these organizations and agencies are waiting for funding themselves right from other sources, so that they can pay me to do it right. So that is a difficulty with the transitioning to a new world initiative.

32:08

In the case of vision Tech Academy, it's all about more marketing, more advertising, more convincing of educators to place their premium profiles on our website, and you know, like advertise your own services to students. So you're looking for educators, trainers who focus on training around accessibility and assistive technology, who want to reach students right and looking for students who want to connect with, yeah, people who provide them training, correct, yeah,

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wow, you're a busy bee. Oh, I gotta stop sometime, eh.

32:54

Well, please don't

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well I want, I just want to be done. Well, I do want to thank you sir for having played a part in my obtaining my scholarship from the apex company.

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I am really, really, really looking forward to this cyber security and thank you very much for having played a part.

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Yes. So what Don is referencing is a training program to launch blind people into cyber security careers. I'm very involved with the apex program. And there is a website, www, dot the apex, A, P, E, X program.com,

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and there's an inquiry form, if you are an employer, a Voc Rehab person, a blind person thinking about a cybersecurity career, please fill out that inquiry format, www, dot the apex program.com,

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and Donna. How can people best get in touch with you if they would like to get engaged in one two or three of your startup endeavors? Well, there are two ways. My personal email address is Donna John, d o n, m, A J, O, D, H, A [e-mail],

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or my company's name, which is Donna John at Sterling creations.ca,

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so again, it's d o n, m, a, J, O, D, H, A N, at, S T, E, R, L, I N, G, relations with an S C, R, E, A T, I O N, S dot, C, A,

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C, A, for Canada, yes, Sir. And if you'd like to get in touch with me, Kirk Adams, at Dr, Kirk adams.com, that's d r Kirk Adams, K I R K A, D A, M, S at d r k, i r k, A, D K, N, s.com,

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or on LinkedIn. Donna, this. Uh.

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Time flew by. It's great to talk with you again and again. Thank you for having me on your podcast. Thank you for returning the favor and joining me and giving me such great time and attention today. I really appreciate it. I'm excited to be working with you in various ways on your projects, and let's make this an impactful 2025 shall we? We shall and I do. Thank you sir for having me on. And I enjoyed interviewing you too, and I think it's an honor and a privilege to be working with you. Thank you very much. Fabulous. All right, thank you everyone. Have a great day. Thank

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you for listening. To podcasts by Dr Kirk Adams, we hope you enjoyed today's conversation. Don't forget to subscribe, share or leave a [e-mail]

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together, we can amplify these voices and create positive change until next time, keep listening, keep learning and keep making an impact. You.